Lok Sabha Debates
The Speaker On Behalf Of The House Congratulated Major Rajyawardhan Singh ... on 18 August, 2004
nt> LOK SABHA DEBATES LOK SABHA
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Wednesday, August 18, 2004 / Sravana 27, 1926 (Saka)
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The Lok Sabha met at Eleven of the Clock (MR. SPEAKER in the Chair) श्री अनंत गंगाराम गीते (रत्नागरि) : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं एक महत्वपूर्ण विषय की ओर आपका ध्यान दिलाना चाहता हूं…( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, we have got a very happy announcement to make.
… (Interruptions)
श्री गिरधारी लाल भार्गव (जयपुर) : कल एथेंस ओलम्पिक में भारत के श्री राठौड़ ने सिल्वर मैडल जीता है। सारे सदन को उन्हें धन्यवाद देना चाहिए।
अध्यक्ष महोदय : मैं वही करने जा रहा हूं, लेकिन आप मौका तो दें।
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11.01 hrs. Title: *hThe Speaker on behalf of the House congratulated Major Rajyawardhan Singh Rathore for his remarkable achievement of winning the Silver medal in the Double Trap Shooting even at the Athenes Olympics, 2004.
CONGRATULATIONS TO MAJOR RAJYAWARDHAN SINGH RATHORE ON HIS WINNING THE SILVER MEDAL AT THE ATHENS OLYMPICS MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, I am sure the entire House would like to join me in congratulating Major Rajyawardhan Singh Rathore for his remarkable achievement of winning the silver medal in the Double Trap Shooting event at the Athens Olympics. It is for the first time that an Indian has won a Silver Medal in Olympics in individual event in independent India. He has done the country and its Armed Forces proud. I am confident that this achievement will spur the Indian Olympic Contingent to scale new heights and bring laurels to the country. Major Rathore’s victory will also inspire the country’s sporting community and the youth of the Nation to excel in their chosen fields.
श्री अनंत गंगाराम गीते (रत्नागरि) :अध्यक्ष महोदय, कल सदन में सदन के नेता ने यहां पर स्टेटमेंट दिया कि पैट्रोलियम मंत्री श्री मणिशंकर अय्यर द्वारा वीर सावरकर का जो अपमान किया गया है…( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: Let us tackle it. If you all give your judgements, then why do you have a Speaker? You decide it amongst yourselves.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Please take your seats. Let us conduct the proceedings in an orderly manner. Since I have allowed him to speak, you should not interrupt him.
श्री अनंत गंगाराम गीते:सावरकर जी के अपमान के संदर्भ में कल हमने हाउस में यह मामला उठाया था। उस संदर्भ में सदन के नेता ने सदन में उठकर कहा कि सरकार की ओर हम जांच-पड़ताल करके उस पर बयान देंगे, स्टेटमेंट देंगे। मणिशंकर अय्यर जी भारत सरकार में मंत्री हैं। वह कल दोपहर तक राज्य सभा में थे और फिर लोक सभा में आए। हम सरकार से जानना चाहते हैं कि वह इस पर कब बयान देगी ?
अध्यक्ष महोदय : आप मेरी बात भी सुनें। I am sure, all the Ministers are here. The Leader of the House has given some statement. I have come to know about that, though I was not here.
… (Interruptions)
श्री अनंत गंगाराम गीते:राज्य सभा में आज इसी विषय पर १२ बजे बयान होने वाला है।
MR. SPEAKER: Let us not compete with the other House. Let us go on with the Question Hour.
श्री अनंत गंगाराम गीते:हम जानना चाहते हैं कि सरकार इस पर यहां कब स्टेटमेंट देगी?…( व्यवधान) कल राज्य सभा सदस्य श्री राशिद अल्वी जी ने भी इसके खिलाफ बयान दिया है।…( व्यवधान)
अध्यक्ष महोदय : इसको कोई सपोर्ट नहीं करेगा। आप बैठिए। It is very unfortunate. You are a very able and responsible leader of an important Party. I am sure, other hon. Members will learn from you. The Leader of the House has made a statement. Give him some opportunity. We shall find it out.
श्री देवेन्द्र प्रसाद यादव (झंझारपुर) : अध्यक्ष महोदय, इस सदन में दूसरे सदन की कोई बात या वहां के किसी सदस्य के बारे में उल्लेख नहीं किया जा सकता, यह नियम है।…( व्यवधान)
SHRI NAKUL DAS RAI : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have come to know that the date for next round of Sino-Indian talks is being worked out. I would like to know, through you, from the hon. Minister, by when the final solution of all these border disputes can be had.
(b1/1105/lh-am) I would like to put one more question. In the event of achieving good Sino-Indian relations, will the Government of India expedite the opening of Indo-China trade route through the State of Sikkim, that is through Nathula border?
I would like to give more stress on these questions because the opening of new windows will provide growth in tourism, trade, pilgrimage, and food industry. … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Let him reply. After that, you can put your second supplementary.
SHRI NAKUL DAS RAI : Sir, this will bring about employment. It will not only provide growth in our mountain economy but also provide economic gains for the entire country. What is the present scenario? When will the final decision come out positively?
MR. SPEAKER: You have put your question very well.
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: Sir, I am grateful to the hon. Member. First of all, no timeframe has been fixed for the resolution of the border issue between India and China. We have had three rounds of talks and the next round of talks will be held in the coming few months.
With regard to the trade from Nathula, I would like to read out, with your permission, Sir:
"During the visit of Shri Atal Bihari Vajpayee to China in June 2003, India and China signed a Memorandum on Expanding Border Trade, which adds Nathula as another pass on the India-China border and sets up an additional point on each side of the border. The Indian side designated Changgu of Sikkim State as the venue for the border trade market, while the Chinese side designated Renqinggang of the Tibet Autonomous Region as the venue for border trade market. The two sides agreed to use Nathula as the pass for entry and exit of persons, means of transport and commodities in the Indian border trade. The exact modalities operationalising the argument including setting up of necessary infrastructure are being worked out by the Department of Commerce, which is the nodal agency for this in consultation with the State Government and relevant Departments."MR. SPEAKER: Now, second supplementary. Have you got any other question?
SHRI NAKUL DAS RAI : No, Sir. Thank you.
SHRI KHARABELA SWAIN : Sir, did we discuss with the Chinese authorities with regard to providing full autonomy to Tibet? If we have made any discussion with regard to that, what was the Chinese response to that because His Holiness the Dalai Lama had given up his demand?… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: It does not really arise from this Question. You have put your first question, whether any such discussion was held.
SHRI KHARABELA SWAIN : Let me complete my question. If you disallow it, that is all right. But let me put the question at least.
MR. SPEAKER: I am only trying to find out how far it relates to this Question.
SHRI KHARABELA SWAIN : Kindly allow me to put the question. If you disallow it, that is a different matter.
MR. SPEAKER: Please carry on.
SHRI KHARABELA SWAIN : Sir, I am the convenor of the Indo-Tibetan All Party Parliamentary Forum. Naturally, I have got the right to put such a question.
MR. SPEAKER: I am not denying your right. Please carry on.
SHRI KHARABELA SWAIN (BALASORE): His Holiness the Dalai Lama had given up his idea or demand about an independent Tibet. Have we asked the Chinese authorities for providing the real autonomy to Tibet? If so, what was the Chinese answer to that?
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: Sir, as you have said, the question raised by the hon. Member has no connection with the Question that I am answering and that has been asked. Our policy with regard to Tibet is well known. We consider Tibet as an autonomous region of China and that is the Government’s policy.
श्री मोहन सिंह : अध्यक्ष महोदय, माननीय मंत्री जी ने केवल व्यापारिक संबंधों के बारे में सदन के सामने अपना पक्ष रखा है लेकिन हजारों तीर्थ यात्री कैलाश मानसरोवर की यात्रा पर भारत से जाते हैं और जिस रास्ते से चीन द्वारा जाने की अनुमति है, वह ज्यादा दुष्कर और परेशानी वाला है। वहां अक्सर भूस्खलन होता है और यात्री रास्ते में रुक जाते हैं। एक और यात्रा का रास्ता जो लद्दाख होकर है, जिस के बारे में कहा जाता है कि वह आसान और सुलभ है। क्या भारत सरकार चीन की सरकार से बात करके भारत के तीर्थयात्रियों के लिए लद्दाख होकर जाने वाली जो कैलाश मानसरोवर की यात्रा है, उसे भी खुलवाने की कोई पहल करेगी?
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: Sir, I will certainly make necessary enquiry. With due respect, I must also say that I am unable to give an assurance on this because it deals with our relations with China. There are set procedures as to where we have to go and how we have to go. But I take your point.
मोहम्मद सलीम : अध्यक्ष महोदय, भारत और चीन के बीच में नाथूलॉ पास संबंधित एक एग्रीमेंट बार्डर ट्रेड और कामर्स का होगा। मेरा सवाल है कि क्या भारत सरकार की तरफ से पूरी तैयारी है? क्योंकि जैसा मंत्री जी ने अपने जवाब में कहा है कि उसके लिये इनफ्रास्ट्रक्चर डेवलेप करने पड़ेगें। ऐसा केवल एक ही हाईवे है जो बंगाल से उत्तर बिहार और सिक्किम के अंदर जाकर नार्थ ईस्ट को जोड़ता है । हम जानते हैं कि भारत-बंगला देश की सीमा के बीच इनफ्रास्ट्रक्चर रैडी नहीं होने के कारण दिक्कतों का सामना करना पड़ता है और इससे कारोबार में डिले होता है। जिस तरह से चीन अपनी तरफ से पूरी तैयारी कर रहा है, क्या सरकार ने दूसरी मनिस्ट्रीज - सरफेस ट्रांसपोर्ट मनिस्ट्री, होम मनिस्ट्री और कॉमर्स मनिस्ट्री से बातचीत करके तैयारी का काम शुरु कर दिया है? यदि शुरु कर दिया है तो वह मामला किस लैवल तक है? इसके अलावा एक्सटर्नल मनिस्ट्री ने चीन के साथ जो कमिटमेंट किये हैं, अंदरूनी तौर पर वे अपनी तैयारी किस लैवल तक ले गये हैं?
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: Various Departments of the Government are working on it. We attach the highest importance to this matter because when Shri Atal Bihari Vajpayee went to China last year in June, a memorandum was signed with regard to trade, and the various Ministries concerned are taking up the job. If the hon. Member likes, I would request my friend, the Minister of Commerce, to certainly get in touch with him and inform him.
SHRI SURESH PRABHAKAR PRABHU : We are pursuing two different strategies with China. One is to solve our border problem. We are engaged in the talks with them for the last 42 years. On the other hand, China is growing as one of the largest and fastest growing economies of the world. Therefore, obviously we are interested to promote our economic relationship with China. I would like to know from the hon. Minister whether there is any inherent contradiction. On the one side, we want to solve our vexed border issue with China and on the other side, we want to develop the economic relations. Is development of the economic relations coming in the way of solving the border problem? Or, is it that the border problem is not allowing us to grow as much as we should grow in the development of our natural economic relationship with our close neighbour?
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH : No, there is no contradiction. There is an instrumentality on both the sides for dealing with the border. Special representatives are discussing the border question. With regard to trade, I am glad to inform you, Mr. Suresh Prabhakar Prabhu, that our trade with China by the end of this year should touch 10 billion dollars. So, the discussions on the border issue are not coming in the way of improving our economic relations which are doing extremely well.
SHRI B. MAHTAB : My question is related to the border relations with China. Recently a news report has come out. We need a clarification whether it is true or not. I would like to know whether China has shown interest to open a new roadway through Myanmar to connect the North-Eastern States, specially Arunachal Pradesh and other neighbouring States of the country. What is the response of our Government to that proposal?
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: I would be grateful if the hon. Member would tell me precisely where this report appeared and what is the authenticity of the report.
SHRI B. MAHTAB : I will give you the details. A road was closed just after the Sino-Indian conflict in 1962. It was going through Arunachal Pradesh and Myanmar to China. That proposal is under consideration. That sort of news has come out. I will give you the specific date and the newspaper. It is an Indian newspaper, a Economic Paper in which this has come out. I will give you that.
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: I will appreciate that.
MR. SPEAKER: Thank you very much.
SHRI KHIREN RIJIJU : In the month of April, a group of officers led by Chief Commissioner of Excise visited Tawang in Arunachal Pradesh to see the feasibility of a trade route through Arunachal Pradesh to China. Now, I would like to know whether during the last round of talks the feasibility of a trade route through Tawang district in Arunachal Pradesh figured.
Secondly, I would also like to seek a clarification from the Government. One month ago, the hon. Minister of State Shri Shriprakash Jaiswal had stated at Kolkata that the new Government is going to review the trade policy. So, I would like to know the stand of the present Government in this regard.
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: If I may respectfully say so, the question we are dealing with is about the talks we have had at the special representatives level on the border question. With regard to the statement by my colleague, I am certainly not aware of it but I would certainly ask him about it.
MR. SPEAKER: All right, if you get any information you can let him know.
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: I will do that.
श्री छेवांग थुपस्तन : अध्यक्ष महोदय, आजकल ऐसी चर्चा चल रही है और हमें खुशी है कि चीन के साथ हमारे रिलेशंस इम्प्रूव हो रहे हैं। जिस तरह स्वतंत्रता दिवस पर अरूणाचल प्रदेश में दोनों तरफ की फौजों ने मिलकर इसमें शिरकत की, उससे इंडीकेशंस मिल रही हैं कि हमारे बॉर्डर पर रिलेशंस अच्छे हो रहे हैं। लेकिन दूसरी तरफ यह भी चर्चा है कि अरूणाचल प्रदेश और सिक्किम में जो हमारा इंटरेस्ट है, उस इंटरेस्ट को प्रोटैक्ट करने के लिए लद्दाख क्षेत्र का एक बहुत बड़ा क्षेत्रफल जो १९६२ के बाद से चीन के कब्जे में हैं, भारत सरकार की तरफ से उसे चीन को सिसीड करने की बात चल रही है। मैं माननीय विदेश मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि क्या यह सदन हमारे देश के इतने बड़े क्षेत्रफल को अरूणाचल और सिक्किम में अपने इंटरेस्ट को प्रोटैक्ट करने के बदले में चीन को देने के लिए राजी हो जायेगा?
मेरा दूसरा सवाल यह है कि लद्दाख के देमचुक क्षेत्र में ट्रेड रिलेशंस के लिए वहां कस्टम ऑफशियल्स ने वजिट किया था और वहां ट्रेड रिलेशंस कायम करने की बात की थी। काफी वर्षों से इस बात की चर्चा चल रही है। लेकिन अभी तक इस बारे में कोई निर्णय नहीं हुआ है। मैं माननीय मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि क्या लद्दाख का क्षेत्र ट्रेड रिलेशंस के लिए खोला जायेगा? यह बहुत चिंता की बात है कि लद्दाख के लोगों से यह जानने की कोशिश की जा रही है कि तुम्हारे क्षेत्र को अगर हम चीन को देते हैं तो उसमें आपकी क्या रिएक्शन होगी। मैं इस पर इस सदन और भारत की जनता की रिएक्शन जानना चाहता हूं।
MR. SPEAKER: It does not really come under this Question. However, it is a sensitive issue and so I am allowing it.
SHRI K. NATWAR SINGH: I can only say that the matter raised by the hon. Member is a speculation. There is no substance in what he has said.
मेजर जनरल (सेवानिवृत्त) भुवन चन्द्र खंडूडी : माननीय अध्यक्ष जी, चीन के साथ व्यापार करने के लिए यहां नाथुला पर चर्चा हुई और माननीय मोहन सिंह जी ने लद्दाख के बारे में कहा। इसी तरह से उत्तरांचल में जोशीमठ से माणा होते हुए बहुत पुराना पारम्परिक रूट रहा है, इससे बहुत अधिक मात्रा में व्यापार होता था, लेकिन १९६२ के बाद वह बंद हो गया है। मैं माननीय मंत्री जी आपसे जानना चाहता हूं कि क्या आपको जानकारी है कि इस रूट को अन्य रूट के साथ खोला जाए, क्या इस प्रकार की मांग है। यदि जानकारी है तो कृपया बतायें, क्या स्थिति है, यदि नहीं, तो बतायें कि क्या आप इस पर विचार करेंगे?
श्री के. नटवर सिंह : अध्यक्ष महोदय, माननीय सदस्य खुद मंत्री रह चुके हैं और आपको इस बात का पता है तथा आप उसी इलाके से आते हैं। मगर आपने जो सवाल उठाया कि बाराहुती के पास या कहीं इधर से होता है कि नहीं, वहां हमारे यात्री जाते हैं, वहां कोई रुकावट नहीं होती है, यदि रुकावट होती है तो बातचीत कर लेते हैं। मगर यदि आप इस बारे में स्पष्ट पूछ रहे हैं तो आपको बताने की कोशिश करूंगा।
श्री अनन्त नायक : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मंत्री महोदय ने उत्तर में लिखा है कि मेज्योरिटी में जो शिशुओं की मृत्यु हुई है वह ४८ घंटे के अंदर हुई है। इंडियन एक्सप्रैस में निकला है कि तीन जुलाई को एक दिन में १२ शिशुओं की मृत्यु हुई और इनमें से आठ का सेम डे एडमिशन हुआ था। इन आठ शिशुओं की एडमिशन के पांच-छ: दिन के अंदर उसकी मृत्यु हुई है। इसके बाद कुछ मैडिकल कालेजों में मंत्री जी ने सरप्राइज वजिट भी की है, उसके लिए मैं व्यक्तिगत तौर पर मंत्री जी को धन्यवाद दे रहा हूं।
मैं आपके माध्यम से मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूँ कि मंत्री जी ने जब एम्स की सरप्राइज़ वज़िट की तो एम्स में क्या कमियाँ देखीं और उनको सुधारने के लिए क्या उपाय किये हैं?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMDOSS: The hon. Member has mentioned about the Safdarjung Hospital about which a report had come in the Indian Express newspaper. I would like to state here that Safdarjung Hospital is one of the oldest hospitals in Delhi built during the Second World War and it housed the American Army at that time which were using it as barracks. I agree that a lot of buildings there are old buildings which need restructuring. I had visited the hospital twice in two months. The first time was a four-hour visit and second time was a three-hour visit of the paediatric wards. I had gone case by case to follow all the deaths which occurred in the report. I had ordered an inquiry in the hospital also. In most of these cases -- about 80 per cent of these cases -- the deaths which occurred were within 48 hours.
The Safdarjung Hospital is a tertiary hospital where terminally ill patients come and those who are sent away from other hospitals are admitted, and when they come to the hospital itself, they are in a very critical condition.
In this case, 80 per cent of deaths had occurred within 48 hours and most of the babies which had come there had cardio-respiratory failure, severe pneumonia, severe dehydration and shock, serious cerebral CNS infections, Congenital abnormalities, Sepsis, etc. They had come there in all these conditions. But our hon. Prime Minister and our Government is very committed that not even one death should occur due to medical negligence and severe action will be taken against the erring doctors, if found any. After my visit to the hospital, certain deficiencies were pointed out and these are being rectified at this level.
श्री अनन्त नायक :अध्यक्ष जी, सारे देश से कई पेशेन्ट ट्रीटमैंट के लिए एम्स आते हैं लेकिन देखने में आता है कि कुछ सीरियस पेशेन्ट्स को भी ट्रीटमैंट के लिए महीने भर इंतज़ार करना पड़ता है। मैं आपके माध्यम से मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूँ कि क्या ऐसी कुछ शिकायतें मंत्री जी और स्वास्थ्य विभाग को मिली हैं और इनको सुधारने के लिए मंत्री जी ने कुछ निर्देश दिये हैं?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: I understand the concern of the hon. Member. But AIIMS is a hospital of excellence doing research work. They admit patients in that hospital according to the capacity of the beds. Accordingly, more than that, they refer the cases to the Safdarjung Hospital.
MR. SPEAKER: There is always lack of space.
Prof. Vijay Kumar Malhotra – not yet returned.
SHRI KINJARAPU YERRANNAIDU : Child mortality has increased in the last few years … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: If you go on uttering `Sir’ every second, how can I hear you? Do it in a manner, raise your hand in a good manner and I shall notice. You just try to catch my eye. That is a part of parliamentary system. Anybody calling me `Sir’ will not be called.
… (Interruptions)
SHRI KINJARAPU YERRANNAIDU : Child mortality has increased in the last few years despite the fact that the longevity of the life has increased in this country. Will the Government concentrate on this issue and will the Government appoint some expert doctors including a committee to check this child mortality which has increased rapidly, particularly in Orissa and Maharashtra.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : Sir, with regard to the concern of the hon. Member, infant mortality has come down in the past two decades to around 63 deaths per 1000 live babies. There are different causes and reasons for these child deaths in Maharashtra and Orissa and in Delhi. We are going to form an expert committee in the Ministry of Health and Family Welfare where all the experts from all over the country will be in that panel to go about not only child deaths but all other important health-related issues.
MR. SPEAKER : Thank you.
श्री तूफानी सरोज :अध्यक्ष जी, मैं आपके माध्यम से माननीय मंत्री जी का ध्यान दिलाना चाहूंगा कि डॉ. राम मनोहर लोहिया अस्पताल में टी.एम.टी. कराने के लिए मरीजों को एक-एक, दो-दो महीने इंतजार करना पड़ता है जिससे रोगियों को बहुत दिक्कतों का सामना करना पड़ता है। क्या माननीय मंत्री जी को ऐसी जानकारी है, यदि है, तो वे इस बारे में क्या त्वरित उपाय कर रहे हैं ?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : Sir, I will look into the concern of the hon. Member.
MR. SPEAKER : Shri Raghunath Jha to ask the supplementary. You are putting the question on behalf of the entire RJD.
श्री रघुनाथ झा : माननीय अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं माननीय मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि क्या यह बात सही है कि ए.आई.एम.एस., डा. राम मनोहर लोहिया और सफदरजंग अस्पतालों में चाइल्ड स्पेशलिस्ट डाक्टरों की निर्धारित मानदंडों के अनुसार जितनी पोस्टें होनी चाहिए, उसके मुताबिक डाक्टर नहीं हैं और इस कारण से बच्चों की मृत्यु दर बढ़ती जा रही है ?
महोदय, इसी संदर्भ में मैं बताना चाहता हूं कि तत्कालीन सरकार ने देश के कई भागों में ए.आई.एम.एस. टाइप के अस्पताल खोलने का निर्णय किया था और उसी संदर्भ में पटना में माननीय उप राष्ट्रपति महोदय ने एक अस्पताल का शिलान्यास किया था, लेकिन शिलान्यास के बाद वहां काम बिलकुल ठप्प है और केवल पटना ही नहीं बल्कि देश के वभिन्न भागों में जहां-जहां इस तरह के अस्पताल खोलने के प्रबन्ध किए गए थे, वे ठप्प पड़े हैं। मैं माननीय मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि ए.आई.एम.एस. की तरह के अस्पताल देश में कई स्थानों पर खोलने का जो निर्णय हुआ था, उस पर क्या कार्रवाई की गई है, उसकी उपलब्धि क्या है और चाइल्ड विशेषज्ञ डाक्टरों की जो वर्तमान संख्या है, क्या उसको बढ़ाएंगे, यही मेरे दो प्रश्न है ?
MAJ. GEN. (RETD.) B. C. KHANDURI : Sir, it is a very important question.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : Regarding child deaths, these were not caused due to deficiency of doctors. But generally there is a deficiency of doctors all over the country because of the policy of the previous Government of downsizing the direct recruitment of all the Ministries including the Health Ministry in 2001 by an order of DoPT.
श्री रघुनाथ झा : सैंक्शंड पोस्ट्स कितनी हैं ?
MR. SPEAKER : You allow him to finish. This is not right. He has not finished as yet. Do not be impatient.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : During the previous Government, in the order dated May, 2001, the DoPT ordered downsizing of direct recruitment of one-third of the existing vacancies occurring every year or one per cent of the total jobs, whichever is less. Due to that, we have vacancies in all the direct recruitment of doctors and technical staff all over Central Health Service hospitals. I have written to our hon. Minister of DoPT, Shri Suresh Pachauri about this and also the hon. Prime Minister is concerned about this.
MR. SPEAKER : You have to answer about AIIMS.
श्री रघुनाथ झा : अध्यक्ष महोदय, सैकिंड पार्ट का उत्तर नहीं आया है ?
MR. SPEAKER : I am trying to help you. You unnerve everybody with your volume. I am unnerved, he is unnerved.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : Regarding the second part of the question, like I have informed the hon. Speaker in the last Session, this project was envisaged last year and only now we are going to the Expenditure Finance Committee. I am also much concerned. A project of AIIMS-like hospital is going to come in Patna, Bihar also.
MR. SPEAKER : You should visit Patna.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS : Sir, I am going there on Sunday. … (Interruptions)
श्री रामजीलाल सुमन : अध्यक्ष महोदय, उसके लिए कोई धन की व्यवस्था या धन का आबंटन तो हुआ ही नहीं है ? …( व्यवधान)जब बजट में धन की कोई व्यवस्था नहीं है, तो .. …( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER : Please sit down.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Then, I will not give you a supplementary. I was thinking of giving you a supplementary. I will not do that.
… (Interruptions)
अध्यक्ष महोदय : कृपया आप बैठ जाइए।
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: If you do not co-operate, I will not ask him to answer your question. He said that he would go there, look into it and try to do it.
… (Interruptions)THE MINISTER OF RAILWAYS (SHRI LALU PRASAD): Sir, he wants to do something. … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Minister, if you want to add anything, do it, but not under pressure. I will have to protect the Ministers also.
(Interruptions)
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I will answer that. … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: This is very unfortunate. The hon. Member has asked about it. You cannot force him to answer. This is not the way to behave. Please sit down. I am giving everybody a chance to ask supplementary. I am allowing even 8, 10 or 12 supplementaries. Even then, you are not satisfied.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Minister, if you have to add anything, do it, but not under pressure.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, the foundation stones of six AIIMS-like hospitals were laid by the previous Government.
MAJ. GEN. (RETD.) B. C. KHANDURI : Rupees 100 crore were released.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: The foundation stones were laid without going through any formalities.
MAJ. GEN. (RETD.) B. C. KHANDURI (GARHWAL): What formalities?
MR. SPEAKER: There cannot be a running commentary. … (Interruptions)
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: I will tell you. … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: You need not reply.
Shri Prabhunath Singh.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Please sit down.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: I will not allow this.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Nobody else’s statement will be on the record excepting Shri Prabhunath Singh.
(Interruptions)* … MR. SPEAKER: Shri Topdar, please sit down.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Only Shri Prabhunath Singh’s supplementary will be recorded.
श्री प्रभुनाथ सिंह : माननीय अध्यक्ष महोदय, माननीय मंत्री जी ने उत्तर में यह लिखा है कि ४८ घंटे के अंदर बच्चों की मृत्यु हुई है। इसमें दो सवाल उठते हैं - पहला यह है कि जो ऑल इंडिया मेडीकल इंस्टीटयूट, डा. राममनोहर लौहिया वगैरह या दूसरे जो अस्पताल हैं, वहां जांच प्रक्रिया इतनी लम्बी चलती है और कभी-कभी ऐसा भी सुनने को मिलता है कि मशीन खराब होने की वजह से मरीजों को बाहर भेजा जाता है। जिनके पास आर्थिक संसाधान होते हैं, वे मरीज बाहर जांच करवा लेते हैं, लेकिन जिनके पास संसाधन नहीं होते हैं वे इंतजार करते हैं, जिसके कारण एडमिशन होने में, अस्पताल में बच्चों का दाखिला होने में विलम्ब होता है। मैं मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि आपने जिस अस्पताल में जाकर देखा, क्या आपने वहां इस बात की जानकारी ली कि जांच के कारण कितने ऐसे बच्चों का एडमिशन कराने में विलम्ब हुआ, जिसके कारण उनकी मृत्यु हुई या डाक्टरों की लापरवाही और मनमानी के कारण कितने बच्चों की मृत्यु हुई? क्या इसकी आपने अलग-अलग जांच करवाई है और अगर जांच नहीं करवाई है तो क्या आप इन सवालों पर जांच कराना चाहते हैं, यह हम आपसे जानना चाहते हैं?…( व्यवधान)
* Not Recorded.
MR. SPEAKER: Order please. Shri Prabhunath Singh, you have put your question. You are not a Minister. You are not answering the question. Please sit down.
… (Interruptions)
श्री प्रभुनाथ सिंह : अध्यक्ष जी, आप रेल मंत्री जी को समझाएं कि इन्हें हर मामले में नहीं बोलना चाहिए। यह हर समय बैठे-बैठे बोलते रहते हैं।…( व्यवधान)
अध्यक्ष महोदय : आपको मौका दिया है, आप यूटिलाइस कीजिए।
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Members, let there be discipline and order.
… (Interruptions)
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, regarding the investigation procedure, no patient is asked to have investigation done outside. All the investigations are supposed to be done only in the hospital premises. If there is any case where the patient has been asked to get investigation done outside, I would like the hon. Member to inform me. Then, stern action will be taken against the concerned persons.
MR. SPEAKER: Very good.
SHRI BIKRAM KESHARI DEO : I would like to say that … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: You have disturbed me. I will not give you a supplementary.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: No running commentary please.
SHRI BIKRAM KESHARI DEO : Sir, the infant mortality rate in India is higher than other Asian countries like Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. So, what steps is the Government taking to bring down the IMR because during the Tenth Plan period, we were supposed to bring down the infant mortality rate to 28 per one thousand child births? So, I would like to have a specific reply from the Minister whether he will pursue the previous NDA Government’s programme to reduce infant mortality rate or not. Thank you.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, of course my Prime Minister, and our Government is very much concerned about the Infant Mortality Rate (IMR). According to the National Population Policy 2000, the IMR is supposed to come down to 30 per thousand patients by the year 2010. Today, we have an IMR of 63 per thousand. Definitely all steps will be taken for further reducing the IMR. For example, in the Immunization Policy, we have planned to increase the immunization coverage of all the children from the current 45 per cent to 90 per cent. We are trying to increase the immunization procedure, and all steps will be taken to prevent and decrease the IMR.
श्री मो. ताहिर : अध्यक्ष महोदय, हाल ही में कुछ संगठनों ने या दवा कम्पनियों ने यह दावा किया कि भारत में ही एड्स की दवा विकसित कर ली गई है। मैं आपके माध्यम से मंत्री जी से जाना चाहता हूं कि क्या इन दावों की जांच सरकार ने कर ली है और दवाओं का परीक्षण किया जा रहा है? यदि हां तो इस सम्बन्ध में ब्यौरा क्या है और यदि नहीं तो क्यों?
अध्यक्ष महोदय : देखिये, क्या क्वश्चन है! Hon. Minister, are you in a position to answer this question now?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I can answer this question when the House takes up my next Question, namely, Question No. 324.
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Mohd. Tahir, have you gone to the next question? You may please sit down.
Chaudhary Lal Singh, please ask a relevant question, and nothing related to your security.
चौधरी लाल सिंह : अध्यक्ष महोदय, क्योंकि आप सर हैं, इसलिए मैं आपको सर कहता हूं।
अध्यक्ष महोदय : व्ाह भी मिलेगा।
चौधरी लाल सिंह : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं आपके माध्यम से पूछना चाहूंगा कि मेरे एक साथी ने पहले भी सवाल पूछा है, मैं भी जानना चाहता हूं कि पहले कोई भी गवर्नमेंट हो, जो गवर्नमेंट कोई वायदा कर जाये, जो चीजें सैंक्शन कर जाये, उस कुर्सी पर हम जाकर बैठ जाते हैं…( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: Please ask your question.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: I am controlling him. Why are you bothering him?
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Lal Singh, please come to the point now.
चौधरी लाल सिंह : रेलेवेंट है, प्लीज आप सुन लें, मैं वही कह रहा हूं। उसी कुर्सी पर पहले जो फैसला होता है, जो फैसला हमारे जम्मू-कश्मीर के बारे में हुआ, एम्स अपग्रेडेशन टू जी.एम.सी., क्या उस फैसले को पूरा करना इस सरकार की जिम्मेदारी नहीं है कि जिस मेडीकल कालेज को एम्स में अपग्रेड करना है, क्या वह नहीं करेगी, यह मैं जानना चाहता हूं?
MR. SPEAKER: It is a very relevant question.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I fully understand the concern of all the Members regarding the six new AIIMS-like institutions. I had mentioned last time also that we are very much concerned about this issue because all these States are very underserved in the health area, and these institutions should be brought in these States. I had a discussion with the Planning Commission, as there were a few financial constraints in this. … (Interruptions) Kindly allow me to complete my answer.
MR. SPEAKER: Do you want the Ministers to answer according to your satisfaction only? What is this entire thing going on?
… (Interruptions)
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: I had a discussion with the Planning Commission regarding this issue, and we are moving forward in a positive manner. … (Interruptions)
SHRI SARBANANDA SONOWAL : Sir, in Assam, particularly in tea gardens, there is no good hospitals and health care systems.
MR. SPEAKER: I am allowing so many supplementaries because this Question relates to a very important issue, namely, health.
SHRI SARBANANDA SONOWAL : As a result of that, hundreds of tea labourers have to die every year due to outbreak of gastroenteritis, cholera and diarrhoea. This year also -- during the months of May, June, July --4,700 people were reported to have been hospitalised due to outbreak of gastroenteritis. In this regard, I have already communicated to the hon. Health Minister.
MR. SPEAKER: Please be brief.
SHRI SARBANANDA SONOWAL : Sir, nearly 70 people have already died due to this. I have a specific question to ask the hon. Health Minister. What measures have been taken so far, to combat the situation, particularly with regard to the tea garden labourers in Assam?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: As regards Assam, I had visited Assam two weeks back to look into the flood situation. I had also visited the camps where the rehabilitated people were put up. We have given all the assistance which was asked by the Government of Assam, like DDT, chlorine tablets, mosquito nets, anti-snake venom vaccines, etc. We have supplied all the medicines and necessary requisites to the Government of Assam.
Regarding tea plantations, they have a rule that the tea plantation owners have to look into the health issues of their plantation workers.
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Prabodh Panda, please put a specific question.
SHRI PRABODH PANDA : I will put only one question.
MR. SPEAKER: Naturally, you are entitled to put only one question.
SHRI PRABODH PANDA : I would like to know whether the Government is envisaging to upgrade any hospital in Kolkata to the AIIMS level.
MR. SPEAKER: You are putting any or every question. Of course, I cannot ignore Kolkata.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Regarding setting up of new Institutes and upgrading the old ones, my answer is the same.
MR. SPEAKER: Hon. Member, the same thing applies to you. Now, the last question will be put by Shri Ram Kripal Yadav. Please be brief and to the point.
… (Interruptions)
श्री बृजभूषण शरण सिंह : अध्यक्ष महोदय, दूसरे प्रश्नों का क्या होगा ? …( व्यवधान)अध्यक्ष महोदय:दूसरे क्वैश्चन्स भी आने वाले हैं। मैं इसके लिए कोशिश कर रहा हूं। आप यहां बैठकर देखिये। ...( व्यवधान) अध्यक्ष महोदय, अभी केवल दूसरा प्रश्न ही चल रहा है। बाकी प्रश्नों का क्या होगा ?
MR. SPEAKER: Please do not dictate to me. You must behave yourself. Please sit down.
श्री बृजभूषण शरण सिंह * : हम लोग तैयारी करके आते हैं, उसका कोई मतलब नहीं है। …( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: If you do that, I will never allow you to put a question. You cannot show your eyes to the Chair. You are dictating to the Chair.
श्री राम कृपाल यादव : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं आपके माध्यम से मंत्री जी से कहना चाहता हूं कि देश में खासकर दिल्ली के " एम्स"में मरीजों के बढ़ते हुए भार की सोच के तहत तत्कालीन सरकार ने चुनाव के अवसर पर पटना सहित देश के पांच राज्यों में " एम्स"खोलने का निर्णय किया और उनका शिलान्यास भी हुआ। पटना हमारा संसदीय क्षेत्र है। पटना ने तो जगह भी दे दी लेकिन अभी तक माननीय मंत्री जी इस संबंध में स्पष्ट जवाब नहीं दे पाये कि वह खुलेगा या नहीं। बिहार का पूरा भार पटना पर है। …( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: Please be brief. I have allowed a lot of time on this question.
श्री राम कृपाल यादव : अध्यक्ष महोदय, माननीय मंत्री जी साफ तौर पर बतायें कि वह हास्पिटल सैंशन हुआ है या नहीं और वह खुलेगा या नहीं ? मैं जानना चाहता हूं कि बिना सैंशन के वह क्यों खोला गया और क्यों उसका शिलान्यास किया गया?महामहिम उपराष्ट्रपति जी को क्यों इसमें इन्वाल्व किया गया, यह हम और देश जानना चाहता है।
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I have already answered the question.
MR. SPEAKER: You have already answered the question. Now, we will go to Question No. 324. Shri Adhalrao Patil Shivajirao to put the first supplementary.
… (Interruptions)
श्री देवेन्द्र प्रसाद यादव : अध्यक्ष महोदय, इस प्रश्न का जवाब संतोषजनक नहीं है इसलिए आप इस पर आधे घंटे की चर्चा करा दीजिए।…( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: He has nothing new to add. Now, Question 324 will be answered.
(ends)SHRI ADHALRAO PATIL SHIVAJIRAO : My question is related to eradication of AIDS in India. As we see, there are more than 55-60 lakh HIV-infected patients in India. I would like to know from the hon. Minister the incidence of AIDS among children, adults and elderly people. Has the Government compiled any data about it to ensure that there are no new persons affected by AIDS?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: So far, we do not have any details regarding separate incidence of children, adults and women being affected. We are going to go for a national assessment cum survey, to be done by an external agency like IIM, Bangalore or Ahmedabad, or any other external agency, about the incidence and occurrence of AIDS in our country. That survey would tell us as to what we are supposed to do, where we are lacking and what should be our focus. In that survey, I think, we can bring out more details.
SHRI ADHALRAO PATIL SHIVAJIRAO : I would like to know from the hon. Minister whether the Government is considering or conducting any research or trials of any preventive or curative vaccine against this, whether any action is being taken for anti-retroviral therapy in case of pregnancies, and whether any research programme is initiated by the Government to combat and restrict the spread of AIDS in India?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Regarding the preventive vaccines, we are looking into three types of vaccines which are: (1) Modified Vaccine Ankara type, (2) HIV-I Subtype-C DNA, and (3) Recombinant Adeno Associated Virus. Regarding the first vaccine, clinical trials should begin by early next year. On HIV-I Subtype-C DNA vaccine, along with the Ministry of Science and Technology, we are going about the research.
MR. SPEAKER: Shrimati D. Purandareshwari – Not present.
Shri P. Karunakaran.
SHRI P. KARUNAKARAN : Sir, there are reports from some parts of the country that small children who are going to schools and who are HIV positive are facing discrimination. Have such incidents come to the notice of the Government? It is an inhuman approach. Innocent children who do not know anything about AIDS are being denied the right to study and right to live. Is it not indicative of the fact that there is still lack of proper awareness among people about AIDS? What are the measures that the Government would like to take in this regard?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I share the concern of the hon. Member. We are in preliminary discussions to enact legislation against discrimination of HIV-affected persons.
SHRI PAWAN KUMAR BANSAL : Mr. Speaker, Sir, we are told that financial support is provided to the State AIDS Control Societies for onward disbursement to all major hospitals in every State and Union Territory of the country. In this context, my experience is different. Some time back, the anti-retro viral medicines which were being provided to some of the Union Territories - including the one I come from, Chandigarh - were withdrawn. I would like to know from the hon. Minister the reasons therefor and the steps being taken to ensure that assistance for anti-retro viral treatment is provided not just for some places where, they say, there is high prevalence but to all the places where the prevalence is modest and where there is need to prevent AIDS.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: I would like to thank the hon. Member for asking this question. Regarding anti-retro viral therapy, we have started this from April 1, this year. About eight Government hospitals have anti-retro viral therapy now. By the end of this year, we have planned to identify 25 hospitals in total for anti-retro viral therapy.
SHRI PAWAN KUMAR BANSAL : This is given in the statement already. There were some hospitals which were being provided assistance earlier, from where it has been withdrawn fully.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: If there is any specific hospital, I would like the hon. Member to inform me and I will refer back to him.
SHRI PAWAN KUMAR BANSAL : Information has gone long back but there has been no response to that. In response to this question, I do not have to provide information; that has been sent long back.
श्रीमती करुणा शुक्ला : अध्यक्ष महोदय, यह प्रश्न देश की मानवता से जुड़ा हुआ है जिसमें महिलाएं बहुत प्रभावित हैं और सम्माननीय मंत्री जी को महिलाओं के आंकड़े पता नहीं हैं। मेरा पहला प्रश्न है कि इन्होंने सर्वे नहीं किया तो सात लाख लोग कैसे आ गए और इनमें महिलाएं कितनी हैं? यह देश की महिलाओं से जुड़ा हुआ प्रश्न है, मानवता का प्रश्न है। आज देश अगर किसी कठिन समस्या से गुजर रहा है तो उसमें एड्स भी एक है।
दूसरा प्रश्न है कि जब पति-पत्नी दोनों इससे प्रभावित होते हैं तो उनकी संतान के भरण-पोषण के लिए, उनकी शिक्षा-दीक्षा के लिए, उनके निर्वहन के लिए क्या सरकार कोई योजना बनाने जा रही है?
यदि सरकार कोई योजना बनाने जा रही है तो कब तक इस पर काम शुरू हो जाएगा ?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Sir, I have already answered the first part of the hon. Member’s question. We are going in for a comprehensive national survey to be done not by the NACO but by an external agency. After that survey, we would be able to put down figures as to how many children are affected and how many women are affected. Till date, we have only around 78,000 known cases of HIV/AIDS.
श्रीमती करुणा शुक्ला:मेरे दूसरे प्रश्न का उत्तर नहीं आया।
MR. SPEAKER: Only one question is allowed.
श्रीमती करुणा शुक्ला:मैंने पूछा था कि पति-पत्नी दोनों पीड़ित हैं तो सरकार उनके बच्चों के लिए योजना बना रही है, क्योंकि वे कोई काम नहीं कर सकते और सड़कों पर भीख मांगते हैं ?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: As it is, today, we do not have any scheme regarding this.
श्री हेमलाल मुर्मू : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं मंत्री जी से जानना चाहता हूं कि देश के प्रत्येक राज्य, खासकर झारखंड में विगत तीन वर्षों में जिला और प्रखंड स्तर पर एचआईवी की जांच और चकित्सा के लिए कितने केन्द्र खोले गए हैं और उससे लाभांवित लोगों का ब्यौरा क्या सरकार देना चाहेगी?
MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Minister, can you reply TO that question? Do you have any information on this?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: We do not have any figures specifically concerning Jharkhand. But we have figures concerning all over India. We have about 709 Voluntary Testing and Counselling Centres. Anybody can come voluntarily to these Centres to test themselves. We have about 738 STI Clinics and 670 Sentinel Sites.
MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Minister, if there is any information on Jharkhand, kindly inform the hon. Member.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Yes, Sir, I would do that.
श्री रवि प्रकाश वर्मा : यह बहुत ही महत्वपूर्ण प्रश्न है। मंत्री जी ने कुछ सूचनाएं दी हैं। विदेशी एजेंसीज के माध्यम से कहा गया है कि इस दशक के अंत तक हिन्दुस्तान में २५ मलियन यानी २.५ करोड़ लोग एचआईवी पोजटिव होंगे। यह एक इकोनॉमिक लॉयबलिटी बनने वाली है। क्या सरकार ने इसका मूल्यांकन किया है और इसके लिए क्या प्रभावशाली कदम उठा रही है ? इसके साथ ही मैं यह भी जानना चाहता हूं कि जो मानेटरिंग मेकेनिज्म है, क्या सरकार उसमें संसद सदस्यों को भी इन्वाल्व करेगी ?
MR. SPEAKER: Will you involve hon. Members of Parliament in the monitoring mechanism?
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: I understand the concern of the hon. Member on HIV/AIDS. It is a very serious concern for us also. Of course, our Government, under our hon. Prime Minister, is very about this. There is a mention of HIV/AIDS in the Common Minimum Programme/Manifesto. … (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: No cross-talk or whispering please.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Mention of HIV/AIDS in the Manifesto itself shows that we are serious enough concerned about HIV/AIDS. I would, through you, request all the hon. Members of Parliament to join the HIV/AIDS Parliamentary Forum. Only 100 Members of Parliament had attended the last Forum meeting in July last year. This year, I would request, through you, all the hon. Members to attend the Parliamentary Forum on HIV/AIDS.
MR. SPEAKER: Now, you have made an appeal to all the hon. Members of Parliament.
श्री देवेन्द्र प्रसाद यादव:अध्यक्ष महोदय, पाइंट आफ इंफार्मेशन है।
MR. SPEAKER: I will go away and I will ask you to sit here.
SHRIMATI MINATI SEN : Sir, South Africa tops the list of AIDS-infected countries. There is a trend of increase in minor rapes in the context that child rape cures HIV patients. Now, child rape is increasing in India also. I would like to know from the hon. Minister whether such trends which are prevailing in South Africa are prevailing in India also. I would like to have details on this. I would also like to know the number of male and female AIDS patients in India.
MR. SPEAKER: Mr. Minister has already clarified that they are making investigations.
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: As far as part (a) is concerned, there is no such case of increased child rapes attributable to believe it cures HIV/AIDS.
MR. SPEAKER: Regarding the other parts of the question, he has stated that it is already being done.
श्रीमती सुमित्रा महाजन : माननीय अध्यक्ष जी, जैसा पहले भी कहा गया है कि यह बहुत सैंसटिव प्रश्न है और इसमें पति द्वारा पत्नी को यह रोग प्राप्त होता है तो पूरी फैमिली डिस्टर्ब होती है।
मंत्री महोदय ने अभी कहा कि इसमें बच्चों के लिए किसी प्रकार की योजना नहीं है। अभी योजना नहीं है लेकिन इसके अवेयरनैस के लिए बाहर से बहुत सारा पैसा आता है और हम भी अवेयरनैस पर बहुत पैसा खर्च करते हैं। मंत्री महोदय इस बात को सोचेंगे कि अवेयरनैस के साथ-साथ जिस पति-पत्नी को यह रोग होता है जिन को मृत्यु साक्षात सामने दिखायी देती है और पूरा परिवार मृत्यु के साए में जीता है, उनके पास दवा के लिए कोई पैसा नहीं रहता, ऐसे लोगों को दवा भी साथ-साथ मिले, ऐसी कोई योजना बना कर, उसके लिए अलग से फंड बनाने की व्यवस्था करेंगे? साथ ही साथ आगे उनके बच्चों के लिए भी कोई व्यवस्था करेंगे क्योंकि वे कमा नहीं पाते हैं।…( व्यवधान)
DR. ANBUMANI RAMADOSS: Even though our primary focus is on prevention of AIDS, we have gone one step ahead now by providing care and support. Now, we are saying that AIDS cannot be cured but it can be treated. Since we are going in for this anti-retroviral therapy, we have put in lot of funds for that.
Regarding the concern of the hon. Member, we are funding NGOs to take care of these children affected by HIV.
MR. SPEAKER: The Parliamentary Forum will help you.
श्री राजेश कुमार मांझी : अध्यक्ष महोदय, माननीय मंत्री जी ने जवाब में कहा कि हम मौसम विज्ञान विभाग को विश्वस्तरीय अति-आधुनिक मशीनों से सुसज्जित कर रहे हैं। यह बात ठीक है लेकिन मौसम विज्ञान विभाग कई महत्वपूर्ण पैरामीटर जैसे, ग्लोबल वार्मिंग, मानसून का वृतीय पैटर्न, सूर्य पृथ्वी सम्पर्क और सूर्य धब्बों से उत्पन्न ताप इत्यादि का उपयोग मौनसून की भविष्यवाणी में नहीं कर रहे हैं जबकि इन सभी पैरामीटरों का उपयोग संसार के मौसम वैज्ञानिकों द्वारा किया जाता है। क्या सरकार मौनसून की भविष्यवाणी के लिए इन सभी पैरामीटरों का उपयोग करने के लिए निकट भविष्य में निर्देश देगी ताकि सही भविष्यवाणी हो सके। …( व्यवधान)
MR. SPEAKER: What is this going on? Let us have some discussion on an important subject.
… (Interruptions)
MR. SPEAKER: That will not be recorded. Nothing will be recorded except the reply.
(Interruptions)* … SHRI KAPIL SIBAL: There are no international parameters for the prediction of the south-west monsoon in India. There are international parameters for prediction of monsoon or rainfall in various parts of the world, but there is no specific model for the south-west monsoon. We have developed our own model. In fact, there is no such thing as prediction of the monsoon. We can only suggest that there is a possibility of rain on a long term basis. But to suggest that on a particular day in a given district it is going to rain or not, is not humanly feasible.
श्री राजेश कुमार मांझी : अध्यक्ष महोदय, मैं आपके माध्यम से मंत्री महोदय से जानना चाहूंगा कि क्या सरकार गांवों में मौनसून मैनेजर की बहाली की जरूरत को समझती है जो किसानों को मौनसून डाटा को समझाने के लिए ट्रेनिंग दे?
SHRI KAPIL SIBAL: In fact, one of our biggest problems is that the assimilation of data and the dissemination of data have not yet been made on-line. It does not happen contemporaneously. In fact, till about two weeks ago, no data was being disseminated at the district level at all.
* Not Recorded.
12.00 hrs. In fact, the Ministry took a decision just two weeks ago that we will now disseminate data at the district level, and that is being done on the basis of the parameters that we are following today.
SHRI N. JANARDHANA REDDY : Sir, the Indian Meteorological Department is thinking of having supercomputers for east-coast of Andhra Pradesh, which is often affected by cyclones, so that the early cyclone warning can be given. What is going to happen in this regard? Has the Government of India got any plan to do it just to help the people of Andhra Pradesh, especially the farmers?
SHRI KAPIL SIBAL: Sir, the question is not just of Andhra Pradesh, the question is for upgradation of the entire Meteorological Department by investments at various levels. Computers and high quality contemporary computers should be bought and must be bought, and the Government is planning to do that. In fact, we are putting up a proposal to the Government so that they can consider it and investments can be made. In fact, the issue of monsoon is not a question of rain, it is the question of life, and that is the manner in which we view it.
(Interruptions)
श्री देवेन्द्र प्रसाद यादव:अध्यक्ष महोदय, इस पर सदन में चर्चा कराई जाये।
MR. SPEAKER: Shri Devendra Prasad Yadav, you give notice. You know the procedure.